Just some food for thought.

Me and B1R were talking about this article the other day and hearing about several people on here having to get another job just to afford a car or another car made me think about this. Obviously people have different priorities, but I just thought this is interesting to read and think about. I'll just steal pieces of the article and paste them here since the article is kinda long.

Quote :

For a huge number of troubled debtors, it all began with a car. Too much car, financed too long, traded too soon.

If you're constantly broke and can't figure out why, the answer may be sitting in your driveway.

The Real Reason Your Broke <Read this. Its kinda long, but good

Just thought it was a good article to read and makes you think about how much you should really spend on a vehicle.

Captain,

Thanks for throwing this out there... maybe we have become old and mature but it is a common them amongst car forums. The craziest nicest cars on the web are 16 year old kids working five jobs throwing all there money into one thing.

I am all in favor of hobbies and enjoying life (I waste plenty of money myself on these things) but as you get older you will realize that there are things in life that are far more important than cars and material possesions.

(******disclaimer: consider this the rant form the old men's club... but maybe it will save one of the younger members from making some of the mistakes we did along the way)

b1r - TS wrote:

Captain,

I am all in favor of hobbies and enjoying life (I waste plenty of money myself on these things) but as you get older you will realize that there are things in life that are far more important than cars and material possesions.

(******disclaimer: consider this the rant form the old men's club... but maybe it will save one of the younger members from making some of the mistakes we did along the way)

here here. partially why my car doesn't have a blow off valve, an intake, many other mods that don't do much, and isn't damn near scraping on the ground .
Been pretty conservative with it.

haproot wrote:

here here. partially why my car doesn't have a blow off valve, an intake, many other mods that don't do much, and isn't damn near scraping on the ground .
Been pretty conservative with it.

Same reason my car is still stock:-)

Yeah I agree with you guys. I have a lot of time and money in my 2005 STi and lately I have been wondering what the hell am I doing? Now I have to pay for another car on top of that. My plate is already full but all I can do is keep my head up be positive. It will all work out!!!

To me it is all how bad you want something in life. Taking out loans to mod cars is bad, BUT If you stay within your means its all good. I am exceeding my means, but I know this going into it. I have the determination to not let those bills slip. My STi will cost me alot of money, but I could die tomorrow because I drank 1 to many red bulls in my life. I do realize that you have to plan for the future, but what if the future is shorter for you as an individual. Thats what is so great about people as a whole, we all make sacrifices to get to what makes us happy.

I think though that the older you get the more you realize that cars never bring real happiness. The friendships from cars are the part of cars that really matter. No matter how crazy your car is it can"t compare to good friends and family.

The other thing I have always found is that if you have no debt everything goes smoother and you have the money to travel or spend more time with family. When I was younger I worked like crazy and made tons of money, but had no life or time to spend the money I made. When I slowed down I had way more fun with less stuff and had the chance to travel all over the world. Nothing I could do with a car could compare to those times with friends in China, NYC, Lake Havasu, Hawaii and all the other places we went.

Is this post being directed toward me? HA HA HA!!

Even though the 'RED DRAGON' is paid off, the '08 is not. I really do not mind a car payment though, as I have had one for 9 years now, but if I had a mortgage like the majority of you, I would mind. I love living at home.

I totally agree with Jason about the friendships attained just from driving what you do. I am sure that 90% of my friends are because of my car and that is no joke. If I did not have my car I would just sit and home and play games..., well sit and home and play games 24-7.

I do not regret any of the decisions I have made thus far. I am very happy.

My post wasn't directed at you ha ha, you obviously are staying ahead of the game. Seems too many people but stuff above what they can afford and when times get tough they are really screwed.

ts4l wrote:

My post wasn't directed at you ha ha, you obviously are staying ahead of the game. Seems too many people but stuff above what they can afford and when times get tough they are really screwed.

True. People max out their budget and if something comes up, they fall behind and can't catch back up.

I have way to much money into my projects. but i cant just sit still. i look at it this way most people my age party thats there hobby. mine is car. most younger people have a good amount of there budget tied up in there hobby whatever it may be. Mine being vehicles. My budget is pretty tight cause of my vehicles but thats my choice. this is why i work two jobs so i dont have to give up my passion. my wife has told me many time that i dont have to work two jobs but if i quit one there goes a good amount of mod money. i only have one life to live so im going to have fun doing it.

Amen brother Shawn.

Cash Money Dolla Dolla Bill Y'all

Pay cash. For it all. That's whats up.

one thing i was happy i did was buy my car outright i got approved for a jetta 1.8t that i wanted so damn badddd but decided to just pay for something with the cash i had. my car don't get crazy mods just so i can keep it reliable and now im sittin here wishin i woulda saved my money rather than blow it on movies, eatin dinner out, and clothes cause now im goin to be a dad and baby bills are retarded expensive lol but just gotta buck up and get work done!

Congrats on being a dad. By far the coolest and most rewarding thing you will ever do. Its not cheap but its not too bad. Its actually worth all the money and more unlike cars!

Nothing sucks more than knowing that if you have a car payment that car is not yours. The bank has a controlling stake in it. Even if you only owe two hundred bucks on that car if you miss enough payments for whatever reason then the bank takes it and you have practically nothing to show for it.

It's not your car until you have the title in your name and with no liens. The reality of owing kinda sucks unless you don't mind sharing ownership of your stuff.

Riptide wrote:

Nothing sucks more than knowing that if you have a car payment that car is not yours. The bank has a controlling stake in it. Even if you only owe two hundred bucks on that car if you miss enough payments for whatever reason then the bank takes it and you have practically nothing to show for it.

It's not your car until you have the title in your name and with no liens. The reality of owing kinda sucks unless you don't mind sharing ownership of your stuff.

yeah but at the same time. if your not born into money or rich. you pretty much have to take a loan out for anything over a few Gs. As long you make the payments on time. you shouldnt have to worry about much. Ive known people that have been more than 4 months behind on a payment and the bank still worked with them untill they got a job. not saying thats the right way to do it. but sometimes thing happen.

It just takes patience and the fact is that most of us aren't willing to save money for 3-5 years in order to pay cash for a car. I know that if I had been patient enough I could have done it. In fact, that is how I should have done it. In the end you save money that way. But our culture is pretty much based on credit and instant gratification now. Hence, this situation.. Noone wants to wait - despite the disadvantages. And the fact that the car isn't really ours until we pay it off.

Wish I was a better example.

My dad told me there are about only two things you should go in debt for, one an education, the second a house. i bought my car and relized what he was talking about after about 2 years. my parents havent had a car payment since 1967. and with that my dad bought a brand new 66' biscane and paid it off in two months. Its crazy what you can do with out that 200 to 600 dollar car payment.

Yah and if you save up the money and wait to pay cash then the car you end up with is often times going to be better (newer model) than the one that was around at the time you started to sock money away. And with the money saved on interest you could potentially have enough to mod it right after you buy it.

It just makes sense to do this. And along these lines getting upside down on a car loan is one of the most foolish things anyone can do. Great way to get yourself trapped into something you can't get out of in the event of necessity.

Riptide wrote:

It just makes sense to do this. And along these lines getting upside down on a car loan is one of the most foolish things anyone can do. Great way to get yourself trapped into something you can't get out of in the event of necessity.

I agree. This is why I started this thread. I saw so many people on here getting second and third jobs to afford their car. Then if something unexpected happens they are screwed and can't ever catch back up. And obviously it is rare for people these days to be able to save up to pay cash for a car, but some people need to learn to live within their means and have extra money around. It is nice to have a sweet car, but some people should work hard to get to were they can afford this car and have extra money at the end of the month in case something happens. Not the other way around and get the car then are working themselves to death to make the car payment. Everyone in the world today is so obsessed with having the biggest and best thing right then and now. You can never achieve true happiness with material things IMO.
I'm not trying to hate on people or make anyone mad, I just feel strongly about this because I have seen so many people get hurt following this path of self destruction.

End Rant

This thread has taken me on an emotional rollercoaster. Deep thoughts. I like French men.

You guys are all nuts. But so am I..... lol

I guess its really how you look at it. Most people have a hobby of some kind. Some people spend every spare moment doing crossword puzzles and it don't cost much. some people spend lots of money on video games and spend all sorts of time playing them to show for what really? Some people ski or snow board. Some people are House addict remodelers. Some people are into dirt bikes or quads. Some football, basketball, golf, tennis. Some folks are gun enthusiasts. Some people do gardening. The list can go on and on. but some things that people do help build relationships and hone skills. It all costs varying amounts of money.

In my humble opinion the article states very good truths........ if kept in context. The average Joe over finances for a car they can't afford. plain and simple. Its the American way. They think they need that Lincoln Navigator and make it happen some how. And what happens when they get it? oh its so great for a while then they get bored and want something else. Cars have become like a fashion statement more than transportation. And so this article is correct.

But then there is the car enthusiast.... And they don't meet these criteria mainly. Because for them it's a hobby. They rebuild half the car to make it better in some way. Go faster, handle better. Using the laws of physics and bending them. And so then the article become nonsense written by an old lady that probably drives a Ford Tarus talks on her cell phone while drinking coffee and is considered by her insurance company a safe driver because all the wreaks happen around her but not to her. Yes I agree..... your daily driver regular car is not an investment. It looses face value fast. They are throw away forms of transportation that somehow include fashion. going neck deep into debt for a "nice" car when its more than you can handle is dumb. Its just a car.

But then..... I have a race/street car. And it's not a car I drive to work and take on trips. I might put 150miles on it in a year on the street..... but 200miles in a year racing it. I'll never trade it in for another car. I'll never get my money out of it. It is what it is. A hobby..... knowledge. mechanical knowledge. Math, Trig, Geometry, Physics, Chemistry. Sharing time and knowledge with others that share the same passion. In the end it's just money.... weather spent on an X-box in a dark room by myself, a rotor tiller plowing my back yard for flowers, hitting a little white ball from one coffee cup to another, or sky diving. It's time spent on something and getting to know people and build skills and knowledge. There are other hobbies that are more expensive and alot of others that aren't. I guess it's all in how you approach the hobby. Heck I started mine like ten years ago. I'm still not done. Ya it makes me mad its not done but its a hobby and real life must go on. Boils down to moderation, priorities, and patience. Some day my hobby car will be done.... hopefully before I'm too old to enjoy it anymore. But It's still just a hobby. And if the dumbest thing I do in life is build a race/street car within fifteen years paid for and go race it and have fun and meet new friends and break stuff on it and fix it and go places racing it with fellow racers and making it faster and breaking it more then whats wrong with that?

The problem is when it totally dominates our life. The car becomes our life. No.... it's just a hobby... now keep it that way. Just don"t bite off more than you can handle. Yaeh... we all want it done right now.... but you can't so deal with it..... dont do something dumb to make it finished right now.

Some people just go nuts with it... just don't let it run your life..... let it accent your life instead.

well put matt.

Of course vehicles are a poor investment. Use all of the "mechanical knowledge. Math, Trig, Geometry, Physics, Chemistry" that you want and you'll easily see that. I'm not trying to make anyone feel bad, but this kind of talk seems to contradict what this forum is all about. Yes, you all have very nice vehicles, but the thing that I personally envy is the friendships built by your common interests. Think about how many of you would have never met if you didn't share a love for driving, racing, modding, etc. I'll admit, I have not lead a perfect life. I am divorced, living at home again, and playing more video games than the average person should, but I am happy. I don't really know what I expect to accomplish with this post. Just keep in mind that what you drive does not define you. From my understanding, Mike designed this forum to bring together people without discrimination over the make of their car or how much money has been invested in it. We could spend an absurd amount of time talking about the best way to invest our money, but I think most of us realize that some things are more important than the balance of our savings account. From my experience, the few people that I have met on this forum are selfless, accepting people. If I take nothing away from my investment in my vehicle other than friendship with others, that would be perfectly fine with me.

I agree I think Dr. Auto summed it up nicely! Like the title says it just something to think about, we are all still learning and this just gives us an opportunity for all us car junkies to discuss life and things that come up from day to day. I don't feel people are hating on each other, we have a thread to boast about how much money we have spent on our cars, we might has well have a thread that counters that one.

I think it is a very oppropriate topic, becasue one of the reasons people make bad car discisions is they call there car a hobby and they over stretch themselve becasue they justify it as one. Again it just food for thought.... we all like to see everyone out enjoying their cars and making more friends, but like anything there is two sides to everything.

Building cars to go fast is not for poor people.

You can get yourself into a lot of trouble living a champagne life on a beer budget.

Riptide wrote:

Building cars to go fast is not for poor people.

You can get yourself into a lot of trouble living a champagne life on a beer budget.

Amen brother..... nice budget conparison. lol

A lot of this falls under want vs. need. Most of us need a car to get around. But you want a car that appeals to you and your lifestyle. If your lifestyle is glamorous and showey, yet under-funded; your hole awaits.

i went back through this and read my post and... im not going to be a dad my ex cheated on me so no baby now. kinda sucks but dodged a bullet at the same time. when it comes to cars i mod because i love seeing peoples reactions. i get people tryin to hate on me but at the same time i love goin to all the meets and gettin compliments, and im still not BROKE... i would love to be able to buy a newer car sure and mod it to go fast but my old car is slow keeps me outta trouble and when lowered on wheels still turns heads like everyone else maybe good maybe bad but i wont get a car loan untill i am over 25 insurance isn't exactly cheap and liability is bad enough for me...

the insurance thing changed to 21 and it lowers about 4 years back.

Novaflash2002 wrote:

the insurance thing changed to 21 and it lowers about 4 years back.

no its still 25 i just talked to my insurance agent about it. Also my manger at my second job his wife is a state farm rep and he said its still 25 we talked about the differences atfer turning 25.

that sucks for you roger daniels of farmers got it done for me when i turned 21

noah only pays $100 a month for ful lcoverage on his camaro and liability on his homoexpress. we must just get the hook ups