At the pump

Anyone know of any Gas Stations in Billings serving up 93 Octane?

Kwick Way at the corner of Wicks & Main has it along with the Town Pump off Hilltop behind Stockman Bank

Good to go! I've searched online and even drove through a few and nothing! So much for this weekend though! Damn weather

all zip trips/kum&go stations have 93 now. i use the ziptrip on grand and rehberg.

Don't use it unless you're tuned for it. Our motors don't like it without a tune. You'll get worse gas mileage.

05judge wrote:

Don't use it unless you're tuned for it. Our motors don't like it without a tune. You'll get worse gas mileage.

Check- this isn't an everyday driver just wanted to get something rich inside of it. What tuner do you suggest btw

steve williams of tunedbyfrost.com.

i wouldnt use 93 for the reason of it haveing ethonal in it. ethonol=alcohol, alcohol absorbs water, and it is 10% alcohol.

usmctx wrote:

05judge wrote:

Don't use it unless you're tuned for it. Our motors don't like it without a tune. You'll get worse gas mileage.

Check- this isn't an everyday driver just wanted to get something rich inside of it. What tuner do you suggest btw

Well, You can buy a Predator tuner that's set up for running 93 octane. But I'd recommend having someone tune it personally. I've run 93 octane several times in my car and gotten nothing out of it other than worse mileage. Even with the supercharger now, I'm sticking to 91 octane.

Thanks for the tip. I'd rather have someone tune it personally as well. Adding a few things and will probably have it done. Steve Williams.. is he local? The site is blocked from my work computer.

I just run 91 in the Venge, seems to run better and get better milage with it.

steve is out of richmond va. he is the guy that tuned jasons gto. as far as minor tuning i can do that. cold air hedders exhaust and a bit of maf/timing tuning. preaty much minor bolt-ons. i did up to the s/c on jasons car.

I get an additional 3mpg using 91 compared to 93.

91 from Conoco all day everyday! It's never failed me, unlike that shit ethanol gas from the place on Hilltop..

I was not aware of ZipTrip carrying 93. When did that happen?

DoodieHead [ADMIN] wrote:

I get an additional 3mpg using 91 compared to 93.

which you should beings that 93 is ethaline, takes more to get the same results

I've been running either 89 or 91 from the Town Pump on King and 32nd since the day I bought this car... in the winter I get around 17 mpg only because I can't get traction anywhere and in the summer I get upwards of 23 to 26 mpg depending on my driving habits. The main reason I run Conoco fuels is because of the cleaners they keep in their mix. Last time I pulled an engine apart that ran only conoco the damn thing was so clean you almost couldn't tell it had over 100,XXX miles on it!

did any of you know that the winter mix of fuels is different than the summer mix???
winter fuel has liquid propane in it to help with cold starts, now the eth/gasoline mixes we are starting to see all around are only about 10% ethanol, so even though you can make alittle more power running ethaline vs gasoline, you lose mileage due to the 10%eth that is in it. granted ethanol has a higher octane rating, makes your shit run alittle cooler, and costs about the same, you still use more to go the same distance . thats why cars that run E85 have such godawful mileage and horribly huge fuel systems... i run it yeah, but if i was gonna go for a trip, i stay away from it.

my car does run about 5 degrees cooler on it, but the a/f ratio goes about .6 leaner when i do too...

The other reason E85 uses more is because the stoichiometric ratio is different. Regular gas is 14.7:1 while E85 is 9:1. Meaning that you need 1 part fuel for every 9 parts air, which is a lot more than 1 part fuel for every 14.7 parts fuel. An engine should not use more fuel because of the difference but the tune will be off causing the engine to run differently. Most cars now days can't detect E85 and differentiate between the fuels so they always run around 14.7:1 which is too lean with Ethanol but at the 10% most cars should run exactly the same. 10% is the allowable and soon to be mandated level, most fuels still don't use that much.

Also as Josh said the winter fuel blends are different, they use the same knock rating but different materials to achieve it. Working with the refineries I have seen a lot of the testing and its amazing fuel isn't worse than it is. If you want consistent fuel you need to run race gas, nothing at a pump will ever be that perfect. That being said I run 91 from whatever station I am close to. If your tuned close enough that the fuel matters you probably should be mixing in a gallon of race gas or some Torco additive.

Some cars today can benefit from 93 like Subaru's that use knock readings and constantly try and adjust for more ignition advance. But you will probably never even know the difference power wise. I use 91 plus a gallon or two of C16 anytime I run more than 20 psi just as a small margin of error.

I read a crazy story today regarding ethanol blended fuel. They bring in ethanol and blend it locally before it is trucked out to the pump stations. Well somewhere back east a gas station got the wrong delivery and filled up their 91 octane tank with e85. Five people now have claims against them for blowing up their engines!

I know where the valve is at conoco to get straight 100 octane

Turbo1k wrote:

I know where the valve is at conoco to get straight 100 octane

lucky bastard.

Please share! haha

Anyone know any body that owns a gas station? If we could get someone to sell race gas I can get it delivered by truck or rail to their gas station. I bet during the summer they could sell a lot of it if you didn't have to go through the hassle of gas cans, blending and funnels!

well what i used to do in the day lol. my dad has a 150gal hand pump fuel tank and a 75gal. i used to go the the airport in rapid city sd and buy it that way. so if a couple guys want to buy fuel in bulk, Im sure i can get one of those fuel tanks from my dad again. he hasent used either one in years. would need cleaned up, but its not that hard to do.

yeah but anyone can go to the laurel airport and get 100LL for whatever the marked price is.,
24/7/365, they dont care because its all money in their pocket
i personally dont use anything but pump gas because my wideband doesnt like 100LL, and pumpgas is attainable at damn near every corner. not to mention tuning for higher octane is a pain in my ass beings i have no nifty little computer to just push buttons on in order to get what i want. it's a greasy, labor intesive task to retune for higher octane gas.

I know the conoco 91 i use also has 10% eth in it.. and before too long i think 100% of their stations will have it. really all zip trips have 93? Ill have to check it out.

everyone ive gone to does... i kinda like it, but im an oldschooler, so anything new kinda worries me...

in regards to the 10% ethanol.... look at every pump out their. They all read "may contain up to 10% ethanol" with the current price differential of ethanol and gas, they are blending in 10% because they make the most money that way. I see that some gas stations are claiming ethanol free blends, however all the supplier that I have spoken to recently that distribute the local supply of gas they are all blending 10% including the refineries, so I am not sure where these people are getting there gas or they are lying.

My bet is everyone of our cars have a 10% blend currently unless you got a special hook up somewhere or have race gas.

b1r - TS wrote:

in regards to the 10% ethanol.... look at every pump out their. They all read "may contain up to 10% ethanol"

Quote :

I see that some gas stations are claiming ethanol free blends

So which is it? I think your second statement contradicts the first.

Regarding where they get the local gasoline I can ask my step father about it. He works at the local Exxon refinery and might be able to check. Logically you would expect it to all come from the local refineries. But sometimes things aren't always what they seem. I've been surprised more than once when making assumptions like this.

Haha I don't think you read the rest of that sentence Owen.

all i know is by watching the wideband, i can pretty much tell if im on eth or gas.

BlackedOut04 wrote:

Haha I don't think you read the rest of that sentence Owen.

On one hand he's saying literally "every pump out there" says it may contain ethanol. Then in the next sentence says that some gasoline stations are claiming to have ethanol free gasoline.

Those are mutually exclusive statements. One or the other can be true but not both. You can't claim "ethanol free" and then have a sign on your pump stating it may contain ethanol. That makes no sense.

http://www.fuel-testers.com/state_guide_ethanol_laws.html

Interesting.

Quote :

In most areas ethanol is added to the tanks by the delivery truck drivers, (local distributor); And, very few gas stations monitor or check ethanol content (% added) of fuel delivered and contained in the gas pump.

Ethanol is probably not being added by the refinery.

EDIT:
Here's a couple other kinda pertinent links people might like.
http://www.montanagasprices.com/index.aspx?fuel=C&area=Billings&dl=Y&intro=Y
http://www.toptiergas.com/

the only station I have seen that states ethanol free gas on it's 91oct fuel is the townpump near between lockwood and main street but another that doesn't have it posted but still the store clerks say is ethanol free is the Conoco across from senior I think it's a Conoco

b1r - TS wrote:

in regards to the 10% ethanol.... look at every pump out their. They all read "may contain up to 10% ethanol" with the current price differential of ethanol and gas, they are blending in 10% because they make the most money that way. I see that some gas stations are claiming ethanol free blends, however all the supplier that I have spoken to recently that distribute the local supply of gas they are all blending 10% including the refineries, so I am not sure where these people are getting there gas or they are lying.

My bet is everyone of our cars have a 10% blend currently unless you got a special hook up somewhere or have race gas.

before kenneth getz retired from exxon he said that every company has a different blend. (im sure if Owen asks his step dad about kenny im sure he will know who he is). you can smell the difference when filling up from company to company. most of the conocos carry blended fuel, because they are cheap. so yes infact i know that some stations do not carry 10% blended fuel.

Sorry my english failed me, sorry for the confusion. there are stickers on gas pumps that say may contain up to 10% ethanol (this is put on there by the equipment manufacture, not the gas station), however some gas stations are advertising on their signs out front claiming no ethanol (one example of this is the gas station in the heights, says "our gas has no alcohol") So the key word is "May"....

I should have not overstated that they all contain 10%. What i can say with more confidence is all three refineries have Ethanol sitting on-site as well as the local fuel distributors. Since ethanol is cheaper than gasoline, i would assume that they would be blending up to the maximum limit so they can get the best profit. But there is always a few that are motivated by other reasons aside from economics so they may choose not to get blended fuel. I do consider that example to be the minority and thats why i said my statement above... money seems to talk more than anything in todays market.

My stepdad got back to me.

Quote :

The local gas stations get their gasoline from the local refineries here in Billings. We add the ethanol to the gasoline at our loading terminal when it is loaded into the tank trucks. I am not sure how Conoco or Cenex add their ethanol, but I would guess it would be similar since ethanol can be corrosive to carbon steel equipment (pipes, tanks, etc.).